Upgrading from V3 3000 AGP
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Thread: Upgrading from V3 3000 AGP

  1. #1
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    Upgrading from V3 3000 AGP

    Hi,

    A friend of mine wants to upgrade his V3 3000 AGP. In the UK now V5 5500 can be picked up for 99 new, likewise so can a Prophet MX. He plays a few Unreal based games, the Quake/Half-Life series and a few D3D heavy games to.

    Would it be better off to upgrade to a V5 5500 or maybe go the nVidia route.

    Seeing as he plays a few Unreal based games I don't think he would see much difference (if he bought an nVidia) in speed/qualtity with these, having to change from Glide to D3D.

    On the other hand what about the V5 drivers, have they settled down enough to be both stable and fast?

    Many thanks.

    Dave

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    Dave
    Dave

  2. #2
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    depends on his system.
    A GeForce is a great card and also has life long enjoyment, considering they'll have support and drivers, unlike Voodoo based cards.
    If he's running above a 500 MHz processor and has over 96 Megs RAM, than I'd say GeForce.
    The Voodoo cards are fine for lower systems because when you run in GLide, that makes up for the system lacking, but than you have to run everything in 16 or 22 Bit color, can't really do good 32 bit, well you can with a V5, but it kills your frame rates.
    I used to have a V3 and I upgraded to the geforce and I haven't regretted it one bit.

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    [This message has been edited by Rip n Tear (edited 02-08-2001).]
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  3. #3
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    Thanks for the quick response.

    Sorry, forgot to post his spec. It is a P3 450 with 128mb RAM.

    The only thing that puts me off is the drivers situation. If they don't bring out new ones, is that bad. We'll yes and no.

    There is one train of thought that if the V5 1.04.01 drivers (or whatever version they are) are the last at least developers will have a stable non-changing platform (in terms of drivers) to work with. Of course that's in a perfect world!

    Don't think he's to bothered about the 16/32bit colour thing, just wants more detailed graphics and faster frame rates (don't we all).

    The only thing that puts me off recomending a GeForce is that.. I switched from a P2 450mhz, V3 3000 running Unreal at 1024x768 @ 50fps in Glide to a Athlon 1.1ghz, GeForce 2 Ultra running Unreal at 1280x1024 @ 50fps using D3D. I expected much more but switching from Glide to D3D cancelled out most of the gain made from the V3.

    Saying that, games like Q3 etc are just stonking but he really plays Unreal, Deus Ex and Unreal Tourny a lot.

    Dave

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    Dave
    Dave

  4. #4
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    Rip n Tear: Have you noticed any decrease in image quality because of a shiftover from 3dfx to NVidia? Everybody say's Geforce image quality is lower than Voodoo cars.



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    MPH

  5. #5
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    On my system, I would say EVER SO SLIGHTLY. You'd have to look long and hard to see the slightest of difference, and playing games how often do you get a chance to stand and stare :-) Anyway if your upgrading, the increase in resolution & detail you could run your games at would maybe cancel this out.

    Unless of course you play Unreal engined games using Glide. You kinda take Glide for granted after a while but when switching to D3D, you forget how fast, stable & pretty Glide games where.

    On my old system (V3 3000) some of the Unreal effects running in Glide (16bit colour) looked much better than on my GeForce 2 Ultra (16bit colur). You have to crank it upto 32bit colour in D3D to match it but of course then you loose a LOT of speed.

    All in my opinion of course others will say different.

    Dave

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    Dave
    Dave

  6. #6
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    depends on his system.
    A GeForce is a great card and also has life long enjoyment, considering they'll have support and drivers, unlike Voodoo based cards.
    If he's running above a 500 MHz processor and has over 96 Megs RAM, than I'd say GeForce.
    The Voodoo cards are fine for lower systems because when you run in GLide, that makes up for the system lacking, but than you have to run everything in 16 or 22 Bit color, can't really do good 32 bit, well you can with a V5, but it kills your frame rates.
    I used to have a V3 and I upgraded to the geforce and I haven't regretted it one bit.
    You know, I couldn't find ONE correct thing in this statement! The truth of the matter is that Glide games are best played with 3DFX cards. Some people like the OpenGL hacks for UT (Unreal Tournament) but the native API for UT is Glide and Voodoos are AWESOME for it! And if you are comparing a Voodoo5 to an MX card forget about it, the Voodoo5 kicks the MXs *** ESPECIALLY in UT. However, the Voodoo5 likes a powerful system. The Voodoo5 REALLY shines if you have an 800MHz processor or greater. So if you have a 500-600MHz system you're really not going to be able to tell that big of a difference playing UT from a Voodoo3 to a Voodoo5. But at 800+ the Voodoo5 plays super smooth. Of course if you're talking about a GeForce II GTS vs a Voodoo5, we'll have to talk about which games you like to play the most. Because as UT is a Voodoo game, QIII is a GeForce game. But anyway, if you had teh choice between a V5 and an MX, go for a V5 hands down.

    Oh, and Voodoo5 runs AWESOME in 32bit mode and looks beautiful with 4XFSAA in NFS PU, but I play this at 1024x768 16bit 4X FSAA. I couldn't play this game without FSAA now.

  7. #7
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    LaoChe,

    Pretty much agree with that but the GeForce II is out of his price range. Price wise, it's a toss up between the V5 and the MX.

    Gut instinct tell's me togo with the V5 (having being a Voodoo man since day one) but (a) support and (b) his processor speed (P3 450) are two things I'm thinking about here.

    Dave

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    Dave
    Dave

  8. #8
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    Pretty much agree with that but the GeForce II is out of his price range. Price wise, it's a toss up between the V5 and the MX.
    Right, I understand that. I'm just saying that the V5 is supposed to compete against the GeForce II GTS NOT the MX. If there is a choice between a V5 and an MX, that is a no brainer.


    [This message has been edited by LaoChe (edited 02-08-2001).]

  9. #9
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    Originally posted by LaoChe:

    You know, I couldn't find ONE correct thing in this statement! The truth of the matter is that Glide games are best played with 3DFX cards.
    Oh, and Voodoo5 runs AWESOME in 32bit mode and looks beautiful with 4XFSAA in NFS PU, but I play this at 1024x768 16bit 4X FSAA. I couldn't play this game without FSAA now.
    As I said, the Voodoo5 supports GLide, which is faster than D3D, and as far as FSAA goes, the GeForce has it too. If he can find a GeFroce with 32 DDR memory, he should also have great fill rate.
    Ok, I guess a lower system would benefit better with a GeForce, because of T&L, And sure the Voodoo 5 will be pushed more by a faster processor, but so will the GeForce.
    It's not a big deal it boils down to his games, and they seem to be GLide based, that's what I was zeroing in on.
    I use FSAA on my GeForce for Counter Strike and Quake 3 and sure there's a performce hit, but I'm still over 50FPS on Counter strike @ 2X2, not too bad and it looks killer, so FSAA is a great feature, but with the GLide boost, I'm sure he'd see a as fast on a 400MHz system under the same FSAA with a Voodoo5.



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  10. #10
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    And sure the Voodoo 5 will be pushed more by a faster processor, but so will the GeForce.
    All the newer cards will benefit with a faster processor (well, to an extent) but if you have a PIII450 (or PII450) and put a GeForce II Ultra you're not really going to see that big of a performance increase because your CPU is the bottleneck. The V5 just doesn't have the speed it needs to really spread its wings at 600MHz and below. As for a PII400 system, a Voodoo3 3000 still has some headroom. The Voodoo3s maxes out at a 600MHz CPU (Athlon or PIII). I had a PII400 with a Voodoo3 and I built my friend a PIII450@550 with a Voodoo3 and Unreal (not Tournament) played MUCH better on his system. But once you get past 600 you don't gain really any speed from that card. However, after 600 is when you need a new card because the V3 just isn't giving you more. That's when you go to a V5. I have a V5 and with a PIII650 it runs faster than my Voodoo3 (with the exact same settings) but not very much. However, once I crank that baby up to 865 the card really starts to shows it power. But I can't keep it there for more than a minute (in 3D games) because it doesn't like an overclocked AGP slot.

  11. #11
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    Hi Everyone,

    Thanks for all you comments, it's been very helpfull. Although I'm sure the V5 will no doubt increase his frame rates, I also think he won't see the full benefit of it because of his PIII 450mhz CPU.

    With this in mind and the fact that most newer games are really starting to support T&L I think maybe the GeForce is the way to go.

    Although I know it's a lower spec'ed card then the V5, considering his CPU, the fact that T&L is becoming more common and that driver development continues at nVidia, it's the best choice for him.

    He's gonna wait a month or so (or until the NV20 hits the shelves) until the price of MX's or maybe even a 256 drop a little more.

    Shame, will always have a soft spot for Voodoo (anyone remember installing the Voodoo1 and firing up the 3dfx demo of Tomb Raider 1 all those years ago?).

    Thanks again for all you comments.

    Dave

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    Dave
    Dave

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